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  • BBWB
    Participant
    Post count: 798

    That engine come from Painter’s? Can’t believe they took a short cut like that.

    I'm at the age where "fuck off", "fuck you", and "fuck it" answer most questions.

    MikeK
    Participant
    Post count: 230

    Is the corrosion on the outer portion on the sealing surface or the the step?  They look like they need a light fly-cut.  At the very least, consider dykem-ing the sealing surface then lapping the cylinders with valve grinding compound.  It will show you if they are actually sealing up and also make a better seal.  I do that with all my motors.

    Also, those valves look pretty sunk in the head.  Were you able to get the valve tips the same height?  It may take some work to get the rocker geometry just right.

    Pretty disappointing what you found in that professionally built motor.

    These days you have two types of builders.  Small shops that can’t afford to have a bad one come back and ones that can cut corners and afford to have one or two come back.  I’m not going to bad mouth Painters as I know they are capable of good work, but this isn’t the first (or second) time I’ve seen some questionable things come out of there.  The final straw was a complete T4 for a customers Bus that lost oil pressure while idling after installation.  It was “pre-run” and “ready to install” when he brought it down.  Never got a straight answer as to what the problem was as after installing that heavy pig I had the owner take it to Painters to R+R.

    I’m grateful that we have at least 3 excellent machinist/builder/enthusiasts in CS.  I have a hard time letting anyone do work for me, but I would trust any of the three.

    Franz
    Keymaster
    Post count: 3363

    It would be hard to believe that the valves didn’t get resurfaced.

     

    I think you’ve just worn them out again.

    ColeB
    Moderator
    Post count: 1502

    Does painters normally just resurface? Or do they replace seats completely? I guess that would make a difference. Maybe they did resurface. Worn them out in 4k miles? I do think I got some dust in my motor on that Utah 300. But my engine bay was the least dusty one(since I led) haha. But Even with that trip the amount of wear I see in this motor seems like a lot for 4k miles. Never had dirty oil in it with how many times I’ve switched the sump and done other things I probably changed the oil 5 times in that 4k miles and always tried to have the motor tuned up right. All that being said. I know it definitely could’ve been me. Because I know painters builds good shit. I’ve driven plenty of painters powered buses and they are all awesome. Maybe I just got unlucky in some way? It can happen to any builder especially with what parts are available today. Also, the whole cam mix up got me thinking too…. Who knows. I just need to fix it. Hopefully this will be a fix. I just wanna road trip! haha

     

    Mike K there was a bit of corrosion. I ended up cutting them on a valve grinder and then lapped all the valves into their appropriate seat. Hoping it all seals up well. They seemed to be when I lapped them yesterday.

    Franz
    Keymaster
    Post count: 3363

    I don’t think they do much work on heads other than re surfacing valves/seats and changing guides….Changing seats is a recipe for disaster. They can become loose and fall out..causing mucho damage in the process. New heads are cheap now, if there are any major problems, we just throw them away and get new ones.

    Its the erosion from the dust moving through your engine. Like getting sandblasted. It goes right out the exhaust. You won’t see dirt in the oil….The valve seat wear is most likely from running down the interstate at 5000rpm for hours on end. The valves have probably opened and closed a million times.

    Keep in mind you’re working on hot rod’d beetle engine that was designed in 1937. More power, rpm, and vehicle weight than it was designed for.

    MikeK
    Participant
    Post count: 230

    Cole, this is the sealing surface I was mentioning.  Mark it up with dykem or a sharpie and lap the cylinders into the heads.  There will be tattle-tale marks on the sealing surface if it isn’t sealing, much like lapping valves.  Also ensures a good seal.

    lap

    MikeK
    Participant
    Post count: 230

    I don’t think they do much work on heads other than re surfacing valves/seats and changing guides….Changing seats is a recipe for disaster. They can become loose and fall out..causing mucho damage in the process. New heads are cheap now, if there are any major problems, we just throw them away and get new ones. Its the erosion from the dust moving through your engine. Like getting sandblasted. It goes right out the exhaust. You won’t see dirt in the oil….The valve seat wear is most likely from running down the interstate at 5000rpm for hours on end. The valves have probably opened and closed a million times. Keep in mind you’re working on hot rod’d beetle engine that was designed in 1937. More power, rpm, and vehicle weight than it was designed for.

    Not to mention that engines are built these days with varying qualities of parts from Brazil, China, Mexico, Taiwan, US, and if your lucky, even Germany.

    It’s like buying every part for a gun on Ebay from sellers all over the globe and hoping that it will shoot without hand fitting ALL the parts.  The best advice you can give an aspiring VW engine builder is to assume nothing fits.

     

    ColeB
    Moderator
    Post count: 1502

    All very true. Hopefully now it will go back together right. 🤞🏼 And I have the off-road foam filters now. With pre filters. So hopefully that will help the dust this trip. Might all be mud anyway with it being winter. I’ll clean my filters daily this trip.

    Got my cylinders all honed and ready to slot in. Hopefully the rings show up any time and I will slap this back together.
    image

    ColeB
    Moderator
    Post count: 1502

    B6E3B209-C460-45CF-A6D3-EC7428563A43Rings showed up late. But they showed!

    jkh
    Participant
    Post count: 88

    Jack must be out of his mind about how un Klean , HaHa…tell em Hi…

    Is that a 3.0 6cyl Twin plug behind yours ? if so..I did the heads..

    Jeff Hines

    ColeB
    Moderator
    Post count: 1502

    Jeff, jack says hello! Different motor. This is a twin plug Klewett injection motor.

    hit a lot of walls yesterday. As you always do. Everything needed fixing haha. Tin was a pain, needed to find thermostat pieces. Weber’s didn’t fit like the empis next to the shroud. Had to clearance my shroud 🔨 Even my generator spun a bearing! Haha tried to put a new bearing in but it wouldn’t seat. The other bearing wore out my generator from it crunching around in there. Luckily I found one on the shelf after searching for a couple hours. Brand new Bosch. Psyched. Added 9 quarts of oil last night with it on the stand and built oil pressure. Going to throw plugs in it this morning and hopefully get it running.

    1F2026D8-27FD-48C1-B389-532F89A10EEE

    ColeB
    Moderator
    Post count: 1502

    back together!

    Rustabus
    Participant
    Post count: 1843

    Yeah!!!!!!!!

    ColeB
    Moderator
    Post count: 1502

    0C92B58D-1FD2-4113-8D6F-0929F1F35B79New starter and I also added a reserve fuel valve in! Got that all working. Should be driving this thing tomorrow! Just gotta stab’er in

    Franz
    Keymaster
    Post count: 3363

    Getting fancy! Nice work Cole.

    mtnbus
    Participant
    Post count: 1031

    Nice Cole !

    you’re ready for a road trip

    Pete
    Participant
    Post count: 860

    “DO NOT STRIKE WITH HAMMER”   Haha…..Bosch knows VW owners well.

    Nice work on the engine refresh!

    ColeB
    Moderator
    Post count: 1502

    Thanks guys! Lets hit the road! Excited to have this thing sorted. Heading to the shop now.

     

    I like how they put the “do not strike” sticker right where you would hit it… haha they do know. I think these newer starters you actually can’t hit. Something about the “constant magnet” technology. You’d damage the internals…. Who knows. I shouldn’t have to worry about it with it being brand new. haha

    alykat
    Participant
    Post count: 430

    Sounds good . Poke ‘er in there and take off !

    ColeB
    Moderator
    Post count: 1502

    7F9C7391-8CEC-4556-84A2-4B75D8BA257BBack at it and running great!

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